Checking in with TikTok's music guru
An interview with THE Dev Lemons
Hello and welcome to the first of edition of my newly revamped newsletter! Today I’m excited to share an interview with the hugely talented and funny Dev Lemons. I first came across Dev on her TikTok account SongPsych, which breaks down music theory concepts in easily digestible videos. I was exposed to her music (check out her most recent here) soon after and was hooked. In this conversation we touched on growing a brand on TikTok, whether you can make career on the platform, and how it’s shaping the music industry. Hope you enjoy!
(this transcript was lightly edited for clarity and to make me seem more articulate)
When did you first come across TikTok?
I think I started seeing people tweeting TikToks like really early on - I joined in 2019. And I was like “I should just join TikTok and see what people aren’t tweeting too.” At first I was a very casual viewer, I would just shitpost and not care about my brand… then now I’m here.
And “here” is you now having what, three accounts on the platform?
I have SongPsych, my dev_lemons account, and lemonparty3000.
Which one came first?
dev_lemons came first although it was actually Miss iPad at first. I started making TikToks showcasing my Tinder conversations but then I got banned from Tinder and all other dating apps. I kinda had to find a new niche because how was I gonna keep up with that? SongPsych came about in May of 2020, which was also around the time I rebranded to be Dev Lemons.
What was the thought process behind SongPsych?
It was honestly a quarantine hobby. I needed to do something and learning German wasn’t really cutting it. I was like “I’ve been doing music for like a year at this point. Maybe I should try to teach myself music theory and try to understand my craft more.” And I really loved it, once I finally fucking understood what people were trying to say! [Music theory] is really cool but why do people have to use such big words?
I was a remote video editor at the time and my boss was like “Hey, TikTok is launching an educational fund, got any show ideas?” And I just thought “Why not music theory? I’ve been teaching myself and music is such a huge part of TikTok, I could totally do that.”
It’s funded by a company called Good Content. It started with me doing everything but then it grew to have a team. If I weren’t funded from the very beginning I don’t know how I would have had time to do all of it.
There’s been a lot of criticism lately of TikTok’s Creator Fund, mostly around not giving creators enough money. What’s been your experience with it?
SongPsych isn’t eligible for the creator fund, so we can’t even get the peanuts that they give us. I’m signed up to the creator fund on my Dev Lemons account. I’ve been signed up since like August of 2020 and I’ve made a whopping like, 700 bucks.
It’s a shame because with TikTok it seems like they have a set pool of money. Then the more people make content, the less money goes to each creator per video, whereas YouTube gives a percentage of earnings back to creators. That’s more sustainable.
You’ve been moving some of your stuff to other platforms, what has that been like in comparison?
I wish SongPsych would have off-the-bat launched all socials at once. I’m really grateful for the success we’ve had with cross platform engagement because at first YouTube was a really slow grind. But now that we’ve strayed away from music theory and gone toward more general music topics I think it resonates with more people. People are starting to find us through YouTube not even knowing we have a TikTok, which is crazy to me.
Is your sense that other creators on TikTok want to eventually move their content elsewhere as well?
Oh yeah. I don’t know a single person who is genuinely basing their whole business model around TikTok. I’m so fortunate and lucky because SongPsych isn’t even my main thing… I think if I were really leaning into it I would feel a lot more pressure.
When did you start using TikTok to promote your music?
How I’ve always gone about promoting my music is that I don’t go out and promote myself as a musician as much as I just promote myself as a person. My goal is always to sort of make people like me first and then maybe they’ll be more inclined to check out my music.
Has the pandemic made developing an online presence more important for artists?
100,000 percent. I think that having a digital footprint as an artist was important even before but I think now it’s more important than ever and I don’t think that’s ever gonna go away.
TikTok has really helped many artists blow up recently - I was at a music festival this fall where Tai Verdes, Blu DeTiger and Beach Bunny all performed! What do you make of the impact of TikTok on the industry?
To use Tai as an example, I think it’s a really good case study of what putting yourself out there on the internet can do. He was just working at Verizon and making music for fun. Not just his music but also his personality really hooked people in. He’s such a lovable guy, he’s talented, and he’s not afraid to put himself out there on the internet. I think all those factors coming together gives someone like him a chance.
Same with PinkPantheress. She grinded! Like posted on social media all the time, was like making a song a day, dropping daily snippets.
I think luck is a factor undeniably, none of us can control the algorithms, but I don’t think you can say it’s all luck.
Beyond individual artists blowing up, it’s fascinating just how much cultural influence it has in music.
I think it’s comparable to - okay I wasn’t really like that alive during this time but - MTV. [TikTok] is the next wave of innovation for music. Drake would have never made Toosie Slide if TikTok didn’t happen, I would bet money.
Has TikTok opened up new interests or collaborations that have affected your music?
I’ve met so any talented people through TikTok! I made Guessing Games and Don’t You See The Time with Whose Rules, a super talented producer from Norway that I met through my friend Carlos who found me through TikTok. It’s definitely opened doors.
And I’ve just made a lot of really cool friends that I don’t think would have ever known who I was if I didn’t put myself out there.
You mentioned this earlier, but what do you think of artists intentionally trying to make songs that will succeed on TikTok?
I don’t think it’s necessarily a bad thing - this is not the first time that people have been influenced by something like TikTok, it just so happens that TikTok is what is creating the trends.
I think it’s hard to go into making a song wholeheartedly like “Yes, I am going to make this trend on TikTok and it has to have this in it and this in it.” I think what a lot of people are doing is looking at the song after the fact and looking at which parts of it would trend.
Are we really going to act like artists want to be gatekept?
Are there any musicians on TikTok that you think more people should check out?
Kinneret has already had a moment in the spotlight but I think she’s really cool, so good.
Dafna! She is so fucking talented but the algorithm doesn’t pick up on how good her music is. I highly recommend her.
Last question - what do you have coming up this year? Any new music, projects or concerts we should be looking out for?
I mean yeah I hope so! I’m planning on coming out with a song in April. I don’t have a date yet because it’s not finished but hopefully April. I’m going to come out with an EP this year. New EP! New song! Maybe some live shows.
Misc. thoughts
I was lucky enough to catch a Magdalena Bay concert this weekend and I have not been able to stop thinking about how amazing it was since. The dream-pop duo’s extremely online aesthetic was on full display with some rich MS Paint type visuals that went great with their mid-aughts paper cup themed disco outfits. I think sometimes synth-reliant bands can end up sounding a little predictable live, but Magdalena Bay amped their music up for the stage with live mixing by Matthew Lewin and a great drummer. Try to catch them on tour if you have a chance, if you can’t then at least listen to their latest project, Mercurial World. If you saw me skipping around Dupont Sunday morning it was because I was doing exactly that.
Another pick that I’ve been evangelizing on any social media platform that will have me: please listen to the new Black Country, New Road album. Ants From Up There is expansive, triumphant, and deeply emotionally raw. After my first time through the album I had to take a lengthy break to process. Then I listened to The Place Where He Inserted The Blade about 50 times in a row. Highly recommend!
That’s it for this edition of unsolicited picks. If you enjoyed any part of the newsletter I’d very much appreciate you sharing it with family, friends, or foes. Thanks again to Dev Lemons!